All About the Benjamins?

It is getting to be the time when I have to choose a law school for next fall. I originally said that I would only go to law school if I was accepted into a top 50 school, and I have been accepted to several top 50 schools in the past few weeks. However, I have also been accepted to some law schools, not ranked in the top 50, who have offered me some fabulous scholarships, some nearing $85,000. These schools, although not ranked top 50, are still ranked among the top 100 schools in the nation. Essentially, this would mean that I would graduate owing little or no money.

While many of the schools I applied to are in cities that I have visited and love, two of the schools that have offered me a particularly large chunk o' cash are in cities that I have never stepped foot in. Although it would certainly be wise to check out a place before I up and move there, it will be impossible to do so with my current schedule.

So. Anybody been to St Louis, MO? Newark, NJ? Should I be afraid to move to cities ranked among the Most Dangerous Cities in America? Or is 80 grand worth staying in after dark?

Comments

[Benji]

and i thought this blog would be about me. i went through something similar last year, but not really. I say go for the dream because money doesn't matter. it may be my naïvety, but isn't doing the #1 thing you want to do the most important thing? Go for the [blue &] gold.

[Sijbrich]

Yeah, my brother went to medical school in St. Louis and he was not impressed at all. 2 guys attempted to hijack his bike one day in broad daylight. Not to scare you or anything, but he really didn't have anything good to say about it and he and his wife were so happy to leave. I agree with Benji, especially if you are supposedly going to have a higher paying job as a result of going to law school, then paying back the loans won't be as scary as you might think...

[Michele]

I'd take the scholarships and Newark. The city is undergoing a resurgence- the state is putting money into the downtown area, and developers have started building high end lofts. Plus, the areas outside the city are safe. You can take a train into Manhattan, and you are located near 3 major airports. (Note that I speak as someone who wishes I had never taken out any student loans, even if it had meant it took me longer to graduate.)

I was going to tell you that housing costs may surprise you, but then I remembered you live in CA.

[Jen]

As a California native who has lived in NJ for the past year, I have to say, DON'T MOVE TO NJ. Yes, you are close to NY- but really? NJ tries to suck your soul out via the fake tanning booths, nail salons, dunkin'donuts and the fantastically rude people. Even when they try to be nice- rude. Save yourself the heartache and the longing for CA. And did I mention that in the summer they make you pay to get on the beaches? PAY to cross the sand? You are far too nice...

[Sarah]

Boy! That is going to be hard choice to make. But when it all comes down to it you have to go where you will be happy in the end.
I know that for me moving from CA to VA was so hard, I was going where I knew nobody. I do have to say I am glad that I did it!

[Hope]

Newark is a cesspool. Cesspool! It does, however, have the advantage of being somewhat close to NYC. But. Ugh. Cesspool!

I don't know much about St. Louis.

[Newarker]

I'm a recent college graduate who actually moved to a row house in downtown Newark last June. Don't be spooked by what people not familiar with the city will tell you. (And being a student who rarely leaves campus doesn't count.) Newark can certainly be a gritty town, but as a previous poster said it's a city in rapid transition, with new developments everywhere. With the new mayor, Cory Booker, crime has dropped by half when compared to the same period last year. I've never felt ill at ease here even at night. Are there bad neighborhoods? Sure, like in every city. But the central business district and most areas are very safe-I actually feel safer here than when I lived in Brooklyn. Just use common sense like you would in any large city. The downtown/university area is building lots of new housing, and old buildings are being fixed up for students, artists, and young professionals.

As for the people, all of my neighbors are invariably friendly, quirky, and enjoyable. I don't know about where Jen went, but over here, you have much less of the vapid suburban mentality she decries. New Jerseyans aren't rude-we just mind our business. As much as I like CA, Californians seem to have no concept of personal space! And I don't mind paying for the beach. A few dollars is worth not having a filthy beach like the free beaches in New York. Ours are white, sandy, and pleasant. Oh, and the water is so much warmer here than on the West Coast.

Additionally, there's a world-class museum here, the Newark Museum, lots of new galleries, cafes, and the well-known Ironbound with its renowned Portuguese, Brazilian, and Spanish cuisine. Most people who think of this city as a black hole are just too timid to actually look for the many opportunities here. Oh, and you can travel to NYC very easily as well (20 min by train). If you're ever in the region, I'd be happy to give the ten-cent tour. You might as well visit before writing us off.

[Zandria]

Wow...what a huge decision! But I have to say, being a self-described penny pincher, the money-factor would be a huge thing for me. Whatever you decide to do, congrats on being so "wanted" by these schools that they're offering you such a great scholarship! That is so awesome! :)

(And I know you're not afraid of moving somewhere that you've never been. Just concentrate on the reputation of the school.)

[Shanda]

Hi,
I am a lurker...sorry. Congratulations on being able to attend law school. The scholarship news is great, and I personally would take the money and deal with the school not being a top 50. However, if you had planned on having to foot the bill in the first place maybe you should consider letting that scholarship go to someone who needs it more. Listen to yourself, and you will figure it out.

[Ashley]

As a current law student at a school that is on the verge of breaking into the top 50, I would recommend checking on the direction in which these top 100 schools are heading. Some schools are in the lower portion of the top 50 and will likely drop out of it. Some will be propelled up due to significant efforts on the part of the administration.

Your pedigree will follow you and job placement rates and career opportunities are really something to consider.

If these top 100 schools only have regional reputations you may be hurting yourself if you have no intention of staying in that area. Sometimes it is worth the money to attend a school with national prominence. It offers you mobility.

One more thing, consider what bar you may want to take. Not all bars are created equally and I would say there is a strong correlation between the state/location of your law school and the state bar you decide to take.

California is by far the hardest, so if you want to return you should go to the best school possible or a school in California. Obviously a course such as NJ State Con Law will be a waste of time and scholarship money if you never want to practice in NJ.

If you ever have any questions, feel free to email me. I also want to recommend speaking with a couple of current students that attend the schools you are considering and not just residents of the state. Law school is a whole different social environment and a law student's perspective is crucial. They may be able to offer some insight about the inner workings of the school.

I apologize for rambling... but I wanted to add one more thing. The American Bar Association Law Student Division is a great resource for getting in touch with some student leaders on these campuses. Those students would probably be able to honestly answer any questions you have. Sometimes the administration wants their student ambassadors to portray the school in a certain light, but if you want the truth you might want to speak to the someone representing the student body, such as the Student Bar Association President.

Let me know if I can be of any help. :)

Good luck!

[janet]

once you graduate do you want to be a lawyer who makes a lot of money or a lawyer who doesn't? If the former, then go to the school you want not based on money. Where do you want to live after law school? Go to the school closest to there.

Just my 2 cents...you got lots of good advice above. If you want to learn a little something about Newark, but Street Fight on your Netflix queue...I've never been there but enjoyed the film.

[Stacey]

I'm from NJ... Newark isn't nearly as bad as people say. It's just in a crowded environment. Once you live the area surrounding New York City, the state of New Jersey is beautiful, especially the shore region which is where I live. Is it possible for you to commute? Even a 15 minute commute would make a difference in the area you live in.

[alfredsmom]

scholarships will change your life. You'll get to do what you love AND have money to go out to eat and do fun stuff instead of paying back mountains of debt. Ive been to St. Louis (long time ago) and It seemed nice. I am sure that helps. "It seemed nice".

[reluctant.housewife]

My two cents:

I would go to the school with the best reputation in the field you want to enter.

Your school's reputation and NETWORK are invaluable after graduation.

[jesser]

The only time I've spent in St. Louis is when I was stuck there overnight on a TWA flight like 8 yrs ago. Their airport sucks.

[jesser]

Also meant to say ... my sis said it's easiest to get a job where you go to school. So maybe you should make sure you like it for more than a 3 yr commitment. ;)

[class-factotum]

I know a guy from my old job who is still coasting on his Harvard MBA. He is automatically given a halo because of it.

Your school matters. It will forever be part of your resume. People will know you as "the one who couldn't get into a good law school" or "the one who went to a top-notch law school."

Have you heard about the signing bonuses top associates get? Money should not be an issue.

[ally bean]

My husband (and I) faced the same decision when he applied to law school. He was accepted all over the place and offered all sorts of deals-- or not. He took the middle road and went to a very good [90% pass the bar on the first try] law school in a city that was safe and that had lots of post-grad opportunities. Some of his education we paid for and some of it was scholarships, so at the end the debt was manageable.

The debt you accrue during law school can be overwhelming and if you aren't in the top % of your class and/or have family connections, you may not even have the opportunity to interview for those top associate positions. And that's assuming that you even want to go into a law firm, which you may not after three years of law school.

Good luck with your decision. I'm rooting for you.

[Sarah]

I moved to St. Louis about 4 years ago and I love it. It's actually a really safe place- that report was very skewed... I could go on about that forever. But SLU is a great school and in a really fun part of town. I'm actually getting married at the cathederal there and my fiance went to SLU's high school. Feel free to email me with any questions! Best of luck.

[Cat]

You don't have to live in Newark to go to school there, you could live anywhere from Manhattan to Hoboken to Jersey City. Newark is undergoing a great renaissance thanks to their new mayor, and on top of that, if you really like it here, NYC has some of the most influential companies and firms in the nation. If when you come here, you want to experience NYC like a New Yorker, drop me a line. I can also offer you a tried and true circuit of the nJ and upstate NY malls, oh so important when it is either a. too darn hot to shop outside or b. too darn cold to shop outside.

[Heather B.]

coughAmericancough

It's a good school and the networking opportunities are endless.

[Shea]

Just my two cents as a current neighbor of Missouri - St. Louis is a really cool, up and coming US city. Ignore the negativity. There are certainly bad parts in, say EAST St. Louis (which I highly recommend avoiding), however, the rest of the city is REALLY cool. And coming from a former Southern Californian, I know what cool is. Then again, I know absolutely nothing about law school pedigree. Follow your heart, Miss Janet!

[jen (in md)]

you don't know me but having done the law school thing myself i have strong opinions on the subject.

i agree with janet, if you want to be a lawyer who makes a lot of money, go to the best ranked school you got into. the school you go to and the grades you get there will be the sole two factors determining how prestigious/high-paying a job you get after school.

if you want to be a lawyer who doesn't necessarily make a lot of money go to the school that will put you in the least debt. almost everyone i know who went to law school wanting to work for greenpeace or legal aid ended up at some big firm job they hate because they need the money. they start off by saying they are only going to work at the high paying job a few years to pay back their loans, but it never works that way. once you get sucked into that life chance are you will not leave, even if you are miserable and hate your job. trust me. i am one of the few lawyers i know who likes her job, and that is because i went to UT (which is cheap) and came out with no debt.

it doesn't matter where the school is geographically. it's only 3 years of your life. you will (should) spend most of those 3 years in the library anyway. if all you are seeing is your bed and the inside of the law school, it doesn't matter where you live.

[Pamela]

I've lived in Saint Louis my entire life (less one year I went away to school) and I have to say it isn't all that bad. Granted I'm somewhat biased since my whole family lives here, but there are some really great places. I'm not sure which school you are planning to attend (Wash U or SLU) but both are amazing. I worked at Wash U briefly for an internship and I attended SLU.
There are several beautiful suburbs around Saint Louis -- Webster Groves, Kirkwood, and Clayton to name a few. The city is turning around with new leadership (Mayor Francis Slay) and the report naming it the most dangerous city to live in was very skewed as it was based on data for a very small area.
I work for Anheuser-Busch and have been all over the country to many great cities but I am proud to call Saint Louis home.
Good luck with your decision and feel free to email me if you have any specific questions!

[hedy dee]

TAKE THE MONEY. I opted for the scholarship at a lower ranked school and now will graduate law school with NO debt. And I will still be working at the best firm in the state where I live.

You will not have time to go out when you are in law school so don't base your decision on how cool the city is. Go to a good school that offers you a big scholarship. Base your decision on where you want to practice and look into whether firms from that area recruit at the schools you are considering.

[Tiffany]

On a night of internet browsing,I just stumbled upon your blog and decided to put my two cents in. Are NJ and St. Louis the only 2 cities offering you a scholarship? If so, I suggest going to a city you will thrive in. Law school is hard enough without you having to overlook the negative influence your environment may have on you. I am currently considering graduate schools. It sound like you travel a lot. Any opinions on Portland, Seattle, or Colorado?

[maryann]

newark -- vaguely close to nyc? and nj transit is much nicer than the long island rail road.

[chronicler]

NEVER, EVER move to St Louis. Sorry to dis it but I have been there on business and was the worst of all cities I've ever been in. Creepy, creepy, creepy.

Newark on the other hand does have a few redeeming values.

All in all, speaking from a parent of a law school attendee, who chose to go for the scholarship and live in a remote, far from family area: friends and family are really nice to have around. Loans will get paid, and it is nice to be somewhere you can get a hug from a friend when you need one. Not that Will won't be there, but sometimes you just need a good friend on hand.